What octane gas are you running for the 1.6 T engine?
What octane gas are running for the 1.6 T engine?
Mainia1
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I've been running 87 with absolutely zero issues. Might try a few tanks of 89 and 93 in the future. Bummer that it seems the numbers Hyundai put out for the Gamma Turbo were pulled at 91 octane, as I can't reliably get that here in GA.
If I understand everything correctly, and I've done a fair amount of research on this, the engine runs completely within spec and perfectly reliably on anything between 87(85 at high altitudes) and 93 octane, as the system adjusts to work with whatever octane is in it. Pros for 87 are that its cheap and you get the same or better gas mileage. Pro for 91/93 is that you get slightly better performance (although apparently it might not even be enough to detect on our relatively de-tuned motors).
Seems like the carbon buildup issue will be the same regardless of the fuel you use.
YMMV. Will report back how 89 and 93 feels to the ol' butt dyno after a few tanks of it in the near future. If the difference isn't noticeable I see no reason to run anything other than 87.
If I understand everything correctly, and I've done a fair amount of research on this, the engine runs completely within spec and perfectly reliably on anything between 87(85 at high altitudes) and 93 octane, as the system adjusts to work with whatever octane is in it. Pros for 87 are that its cheap and you get the same or better gas mileage. Pro for 91/93 is that you get slightly better performance (although apparently it might not even be enough to detect on our relatively de-tuned motors).
Seems like the carbon buildup issue will be the same regardless of the fuel you use.
YMMV. Will report back how 89 and 93 feels to the ol' butt dyno after a few tanks of it in the near future. If the difference isn't noticeable I see no reason to run anything other than 87.
The Kona comes set to 12PSI, and produces 195whp to the front wheels at that boost level. It is a 10:1 compression variant of the Gamma 1.6L, and it has a different turbo than the older veloster and elantra sport.
The boost pressure is lower than on the 2013-2015 Veloster Turbo, Forte Koup, Forte5 and 2015 Elantra Sport.
This info coming from a reputable Hyundai tuner in Puerto Rico who put the Kona onto a Dynojet with stock everything and did three back to back runs that averaged 195whp. He also read the Kona ECU files, but could not write (tune) the files.
P.S. the runs were done using 93 octane.
The boost pressure is lower than on the 2013-2015 Veloster Turbo, Forte Koup, Forte5 and 2015 Elantra Sport.
This info coming from a reputable Hyundai tuner in Puerto Rico who put the Kona onto a Dynojet with stock everything and did three back to back runs that averaged 195whp. He also read the Kona ECU files, but could not write (tune) the files.
P.S. the runs were done using 93 octane.
[QUOTEThe Kona comes set to 12 psi[/QUOTE]
The absolute max boost for the Kona is capped @ 20 psi. Max boost @ 3850-4000 rpm is over 18+psi depending upon atmospheric conditions.
David, post the website so all can see the results. Where's the source of the information?
There are already several tunes written by Vivid Racing and it costs $500.00 but you have to send the ECU in to have it flashed tuned by them. Vivid Racing who is a reputable tuner and has been for quite sometime, rates the crank horsepower at Hyundai's 175 also. https://www.vividracing.com/tuned-ecu-flash-tune-hyundai-kona-16l-turbo-175hp-p-152430482.html
Your talking about a bone stock Kona that is rated at 175 crank horsepower by Hyundai themselves making 195 whp. That's an extremely big variance from crank to whp @ around 15% over the OEM rating. It goes the other way around as you lose 50-75 horsepower as the power is transferred from the crankshaft to the wheels.
I would say the tuner in Puerto Rico doesn't know what he's doing or isn't very reputable at all. Needless to say, there are good tuners and then the rest. Just because they say it so doesn't make it so.
Blessings and Peace
The absolute max boost for the Kona is capped @ 20 psi. Max boost @ 3850-4000 rpm is over 18+psi depending upon atmospheric conditions.
David, post the website so all can see the results. Where's the source of the information?
There are already several tunes written by Vivid Racing and it costs $500.00 but you have to send the ECU in to have it flashed tuned by them. Vivid Racing who is a reputable tuner and has been for quite sometime, rates the crank horsepower at Hyundai's 175 also. https://www.vividracing.com/tuned-ecu-flash-tune-hyundai-kona-16l-turbo-175hp-p-152430482.html
Your talking about a bone stock Kona that is rated at 175 crank horsepower by Hyundai themselves making 195 whp. That's an extremely big variance from crank to whp @ around 15% over the OEM rating. It goes the other way around as you lose 50-75 horsepower as the power is transferred from the crankshaft to the wheels.
I would say the tuner in Puerto Rico doesn't know what he's doing or isn't very reputable at all. Needless to say, there are good tuners and then the rest. Just because they say it so doesn't make it so.
Blessings and Peace
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My bone stock engine in my Kona AWD 1.6T has seen 17.7 PSI with mid grade gas. But it has been said here that the boost is the same but the ECU just pulls back the timing. So I think your guy is wrong.
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David, https://www.facebook.com/AlphaSpeedPR .
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These are the guys your talking about. . They're full of it bottomline and if you actually believe this, I got a Auto Zone franchise to sell you. Oh that's right, you work at one. Not the IIHS like you claimed to David! Amazing how that's works when you leave traces of yourself on Facebook. Oh you're not an automotive engineer or a NASCAR Mechanic either. You don't need to make up a bunch of stories about yourself to impress anyone, so quit and be yourself. Be yourself and be happy with who your are and what you do.
I'd say the tuner in Puerto Rico doesn't know what he's doing or isn't very reputable at all. Needless to say, there are good tuners and then the rest. Just because they say it so, doesn't make it so, just like you've claimed have in the past. Creditability says allot about a person in general David, so does integrity. Try a new start and be up front with everyone here, save the stories for the movies.
Blessings and Peace
These are the guys your talking about. . They're full of it bottomline and if you actually believe this, I got a Auto Zone franchise to sell you. Oh that's right, you work at one. Not the IIHS like you claimed to David! Amazing how that's works when you leave traces of yourself on Facebook. Oh you're not an automotive engineer or a NASCAR Mechanic either. You don't need to make up a bunch of stories about yourself to impress anyone, so quit and be yourself. Be yourself and be happy with who your are and what you do.
I'd say the tuner in Puerto Rico doesn't know what he's doing or isn't very reputable at all. Needless to say, there are good tuners and then the rest. Just because they say it so, doesn't make it so, just like you've claimed have in the past. Creditability says allot about a person in general David, so does integrity. Try a new start and be up front with everyone here, save the stories for the movies.
Blessings and Peace
David, I can also tell you by the run file and horsepower curve, this is a Veloster dyno, especially after doing some research. Meaning the run file is from a Veloster with an apparent tune and no other modifications. The directory file title can be changed easily to represent a Kona.
Nice try but it doesn't belong to a Kona. They didn't even give the torque run file which is purposefully omitted. The Dyno Jet is set to a standard configuration on any initial run, to provide both whp and tq. You have to purposefully exclude it in the primary setting before the run.
Heres an appropriate OEM Kona Dyno Jet run.
Trying to promote business by deception, is nothing but purposeful misrepresentation and greed. Nuff said!
Blessings and Peace
Nice try but it doesn't belong to a Kona. They didn't even give the torque run file which is purposefully omitted. The Dyno Jet is set to a standard configuration on any initial run, to provide both whp and tq. You have to purposefully exclude it in the primary setting before the run.
Heres an appropriate OEM Kona Dyno Jet run.
Trying to promote business by deception, is nothing but purposeful misrepresentation and greed. Nuff said!
Blessings and Peace
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Dealer told me to run 87. I tried a 2 tanks of premium and lost fuel mileage.
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We're nearing 10,000 miles on our Kona(!), and after running lots of tanks of both regular and premium, I can say that through the butt dyno and mileage counter, here are the differences I've noted:
Regular (87): Noticeable hesitation at stops, like the engine revs up a little bit before engaging the clutch. Especially noticeable at quick stops where the weight is still shifting (like at a stop sign with no one around). Average of 29.1mpg on these tanks according to the computer (and yes, I know the computer isn't accurate).
Premium (93): Less hesitation at stops, noticeably faster acceleration from a stop, faster throttle response, slightly better mid-range power. I don't notice the power gain as much if at all on the highway, however, like a 70-80mph acceleration doesn't feel noticeably different. Average of 28.9mpg on these tanks, but that dip might be because I tend to gun it more often when I'm running Premium...
Obviously YMMV and its impossible to measure how much of this is just in my head, etc.
Regular (87): Noticeable hesitation at stops, like the engine revs up a little bit before engaging the clutch. Especially noticeable at quick stops where the weight is still shifting (like at a stop sign with no one around). Average of 29.1mpg on these tanks according to the computer (and yes, I know the computer isn't accurate).
Premium (93): Less hesitation at stops, noticeably faster acceleration from a stop, faster throttle response, slightly better mid-range power. I don't notice the power gain as much if at all on the highway, however, like a 70-80mph acceleration doesn't feel noticeably different. Average of 28.9mpg on these tanks, but that dip might be because I tend to gun it more often when I'm running Premium...
Obviously YMMV and its impossible to measure how much of this is just in my head, etc.
Best answer from a dealer yet... From everything I read and techs I spoke to, These engines are setup to run on regular and DO NOT take advantage of premium by allowing more timing.. The Genesis is the only car that has the programming to take advantage of premium by allowing more timing for more power..
I’m currently running premium for the second tank and noticed No difference in mileage or performance.. Back to regular and since it’s selling for $1.97 a gallon... it’s making this car more enjoyable.. !!
Seems European cars have different programming and might take advantage of the higher octane.. but not US Kona’s.
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The DTE system ONLY raises boost and nothing else, I know this for sure, since I called them. This way all other safety systems stay in place from the factory and the overly rich fuel map stays in place, DTE doesn't have to worry about going lean and blowing up motors like ECU flash tuners can/do.
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The octane rating is a measure of pre-ignition or knock resistance. The higher the compression ratio of the engine the more inclined it is to have pre-ignition of the fuel which is damaging to the piston. If the engine is designed for lower octane rated fuel then putting in a higher octane fuel accomplishes nothing. On the other hand with a high compression engine that is designed for a higher octane fuel is run with regular gas then the engine computer will retart the spark to protect the engine and the result will be less power and poorer fuel economy.
Air filters with paper media work perfectly well. I use K&N filters in the 1970's when I was doing off-road races and even then I did not see any real improvement with their filters. They were better than pleated filters of the day but a lot has changed.
With motor oil for a normal gas engine any oil that meets the API specs is as good as any other. For pre 2017 gas engines I use a dino motor oil and for my newer vehicles I use a blend and for my diesel truck I will be switching to the new CK-4 motor oils and probably Valvoline or Pennzoil as they have the best additive mixes.
What few realize is that the days of using TBN to determine remaining life of a motor oil sample is no longer accurate with the new motor oil formulations although the labs are not going to tell this to anyone and hurt their profits.
Air filters with paper media work perfectly well. I use K&N filters in the 1970's when I was doing off-road races and even then I did not see any real improvement with their filters. They were better than pleated filters of the day but a lot has changed.
With motor oil for a normal gas engine any oil that meets the API specs is as good as any other. For pre 2017 gas engines I use a dino motor oil and for my newer vehicles I use a blend and for my diesel truck I will be switching to the new CK-4 motor oils and probably Valvoline or Pennzoil as they have the best additive mixes.
What few realize is that the days of using TBN to determine remaining life of a motor oil sample is no longer accurate with the new motor oil formulations although the labs are not going to tell this to anyone and hurt their profits.
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240 Posts
Anyone else running ethanol-free gas? It's 89 octane if I recall, but I'm getting pretty decent millage and I swear the engine runs a bit stronger. Yes it's a bit more expensive, I had run it in my 2011 Tucson for about a year and now the Kona. I can tell pretty quickly when I put regular gas in instead of the ethanol-free, the engine just isn't as "snappy". I saw the river rats (boat racers) filling up one day and decided to ask, that's all they put in their truck and boat engines and swear by it.
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I am running ethanol free 87 mixed with 91. I mix it 50/50 and I am getting really good fuel economy. The power is also always there since it should come out to about 89 and less than 5% ethanol.
Since ethanol has less energy per volume you should get better fuel economy without it.
I have a scan gauge that I use for IAT, Throttle and Boost and I have noticed that this engine makes a ton of boost at mid throttle.
I would personally only run 89 or higher in this thing even if you never floor it. This morning I saw 17psi at 55% TPS and about 3500rpm.
Kona (Hyundai Kona) | Fuelly
Since ethanol has less energy per volume you should get better fuel economy without it.
I have a scan gauge that I use for IAT, Throttle and Boost and I have noticed that this engine makes a ton of boost at mid throttle.
I would personally only run 89 or higher in this thing even if you never floor it. This morning I saw 17psi at 55% TPS and about 3500rpm.
Kona (Hyundai Kona) | Fuelly
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I get 17psi below 2,000 rpm, the motor is spec to get 195lbs of torque at less then 1,700 rpm ....that means full boost at that figure .
Car and Driver says 195lbs torque at 1,500 rpm ...Holly LSPI !!!!
https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a20154728/2018-hyundai-kona-16l-turbo-awd-test-review/
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Has your scan gauge shown any knock detection? if not, the KONA ECU programming does not take advantage of premium fuel..
So you won’t see any benefits. DI has the ability to run high boost levels safely without retarding timing or causing detonation..
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The only reason that is the case is because they are flooding the cylinder with an "over the top" fuel to air ratio of gas to prevent detonation and include non-aggressive timing advance. Add to that, another % more fuel when they found out about LSPI. No wonder the tail pipes of DI turbos have soot in them and an oil sump full of gas.
As far as running 87 octane in a 10:1 compression turbo, it ONLY can be done by a "compromised retarded ignition algorithm". There has to be 20 PLUS hp left on the table, along with gas mileage because of it. We still don't know if the Kona's adaptive learning gives more ignition advance to an aggressively used car over the long term. Seeing I have detonation with 87 octane and my foot has been in it since day 5. 87 octane will never see my tank. 89 during the winter and I try to do 91/93 during the summer since I can hear slight detonation in the summer with 100% 89 octane.
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