I am a new Kona EV owner - had the car almost 3 weeks now. I know this is a topic that has been discussed but I can never find a black and white answer. I even emailed Hyundai and got some sort of canned email response about contacting my local dealership. The dealership was nice and all but when it came to this Kona EV they really didn't seem to much about the EV version. I knew way more than they knew. I would love to charge to 100% and I did it the 1st couple of Level 2 charges. Then got spooked and set the limit for 80%. I read a couple places (other forums - nothing from Hyundai) that Hyundai created a safety limit and when our cars say 100% that is actually 80% to protect the battery. If that is the case I'd love to charge to 100%. Does anyone actually know?
Charging - 80% or 100%?
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Your guess is as good as mine. Like you I researched as much as I could find on this subject, with no clear answers for the Kona EV. I do know that the Kona EV TMS is more robust (coolant, etc) than previous Hyundai (and other) EV vehicles. And the manual does not specifically say avoid or minimize charging to 100%
However, despite all that, I have decided for the time being to avoid charging to 100% except when going on a trip, or will be soon after using up that extra charge. Just charging to 80% on the Kona gives me more than enough range for normal around town, and short trip driving.
However, despite all that, I have decided for the time being to avoid charging to 100% except when going on a trip, or will be soon after using up that extra charge. Just charging to 80% on the Kona gives me more than enough range for normal around town, and short trip driving.
I also contacted Hyundai. My dealer was not able to give me an answer. He said Hyundai told him we should not use a level 2 charging station on a regular basis. That does not sound correct to me at all. The Kona EV is made to handle even a Level 3 station. I love my Hyundai!
I too have wandered the web looking for a definitive statement but even though electric cars have been around a few years there is no simple explanation or plan. If you need only 80% then it would be better to only charge to that amount because they say the sweet spot for battery longevity is between 20-80% but if you need 100% because of a longer trip then what I have read is go to 100% but do not leave it sitting for longer than 8hrs fully charged.
I wait till I am down around 20% then charge to 80%. If I am going a fair distance the next day I often Level 2 charge to 80% two days before then top it off to 100% using Level 1 the night before I leave - I am lucky I have both Level 1 and 2. If I don't drive a longer distance I still charge to 100% once a month but make sure I do not leave it at 100% - check out the Battery University online or this article is not bad, https://pushevs.com/2018/04/27/battery-charging-full-versus-partial/
BTW some people charge to 100% every night and have no concerns!
Not exactly a black and white answer but most of the above appears in a fair number of places.
I wait till I am down around 20% then charge to 80%. If I am going a fair distance the next day I often Level 2 charge to 80% two days before then top it off to 100% using Level 1 the night before I leave - I am lucky I have both Level 1 and 2. If I don't drive a longer distance I still charge to 100% once a month but make sure I do not leave it at 100% - check out the Battery University online or this article is not bad, https://pushevs.com/2018/04/27/battery-charging-full-versus-partial/
BTW some people charge to 100% every night and have no concerns!
Not exactly a black and white answer but most of the above appears in a fair number of places.
Yes, that appears about right. Charge to 80% most of time. Charge to 100% just before a long trip. Kona EV has a 67.1 kWh battery but only uses 64.0, so retains 3 kWh as safety reserve. But this reserve will get used up over time as you charge, more quickly if you charge to higher levels.
If you’re not concerned about distance you can charge to 100% every time. But that means after 5-8 years your max range will likely be 300 km rather than 400 due to battery deterioration.
The problem (well one of the problems) for Li batteries is being left on high charge levels for any period of time. I notice that, while not the exact same battery, Apple are updating their software in September to charge their Li batteries to 80% when first plugged in overnight, with a trickle charge for about an hour before you get up (Yes, the iPhone is now going to monitor your sleeping patterns).
This will extend battery life & how long batteries retain charge, but if you don’t care about that then you can still charge to 100%.
And discharging to very low levels can be really nasty because it physically damages the battery.
If you’re not concerned about distance you can charge to 100% every time. But that means after 5-8 years your max range will likely be 300 km rather than 400 due to battery deterioration.
The problem (well one of the problems) for Li batteries is being left on high charge levels for any period of time. I notice that, while not the exact same battery, Apple are updating their software in September to charge their Li batteries to 80% when first plugged in overnight, with a trickle charge for about an hour before you get up (Yes, the iPhone is now going to monitor your sleeping patterns).
This will extend battery life & how long batteries retain charge, but if you don’t care about that then you can still charge to 100%.
And discharging to very low levels can be really nasty because it physically damages the battery.
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Hyundai may have built in a buffer, on some other forums people have calculated it at ~5%
I am planning on getting a Kona EV sometime in the future, and I personally would charge it to ~80% for normal operation.
Just general care for Lithium Batteries.
Even apple know it's an issue and let you limit charge of the iPhone now!
I am planning on getting a Kona EV sometime in the future, and I personally would charge it to ~80% for normal operation.
Just general care for Lithium Batteries.
Even apple know it's an issue and let you limit charge of the iPhone now!
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726 Posts
A charging strategy
Various, authoritative-looking sites have published advice about the number of cycles a lithium ion battery will deliver under various charging regimes without significant loss of storage capacity. The conventional wisdom seems to be to avoid running the battery down too far, to avoid leaving...
www.hyundaikonaforum.com
Email I just received from Hyundai... no help what so ever.
"Based on the information provided, we have reviewed our records and show that it would be up to your own discretion; as the owner of the Kona EV, on whether or not to charge your vehicle up to 100% on Level 2 charger.
For any additional inquiries regarding the operation and features of your Kona EV it is advised speaking with your local Hyundai dealership."
"Based on the information provided, we have reviewed our records and show that it would be up to your own discretion; as the owner of the Kona EV, on whether or not to charge your vehicle up to 100% on Level 2 charger.
For any additional inquiries regarding the operation and features of your Kona EV it is advised speaking with your local Hyundai dealership."
My understanding, as an electronic technician, is that the life of lithium-ion batteries, such as used in the Hyundai Kona Electric, is good for the warranty period when operated to a maximum capacity of 80% of the actual capacity of the battery. The charging system of the car is set to only charge the battery to this level. So when the charge indicator on the dashboard indicates a 100% charge the actual battery is only charged to 80% of its capacity. The charging system is designed to cut off above the 100% indicated on the dashboard. That safeguards the battery and provides for the long life specified in the warranty.
Never discharging below 20% indication on the dashboard will extend the battery life a bit longer as will consistently keeping the the maximum charge below 81% as indicated on the dashboard.
In the case of my new Kona Electric I intend to charge to 80% for most of the time while extending that to 100% in the case where I need to drive long stretches between charging stations.
The Kona Electric charger limits DC - Level-3 charging to 80% as shown on the dashboard to prevent battery degradation, at such high charge rates, above that 80% indication. One can then safely charge to 100% (on the dashboard) using Level-2, or Level-1 charging following the DC charging. My intention is to avoid using DC - Level-3 charging unless it is essential for long trips between charging stations.
Never discharging below 20% indication on the dashboard will extend the battery life a bit longer as will consistently keeping the the maximum charge below 81% as indicated on the dashboard.
In the case of my new Kona Electric I intend to charge to 80% for most of the time while extending that to 100% in the case where I need to drive long stretches between charging stations.
The Kona Electric charger limits DC - Level-3 charging to 80% as shown on the dashboard to prevent battery degradation, at such high charge rates, above that 80% indication. One can then safely charge to 100% (on the dashboard) using Level-2, or Level-1 charging following the DC charging. My intention is to avoid using DC - Level-3 charging unless it is essential for long trips between charging stations.
If you can confirm those capacities I’d be very grateful. I can’t find anything from Hyundai or independent research that clearly states how their batteries work ?
In relation to warranty it’s a bit different in Australia. Hyundai guarantee that max charge available from battery will not decrease below 80% in next 8 years. So max available capacity is currently 64 kWh, and they warrant it will not drop below 51kWh. Or in distance terms, current range is 450 km and they warrant range in 8 years time will be at least 360 km.
That said a lot has been written about Li battery deterioration, & your charging strategies are pretty much exactly what is recommended to maximise battery life (& range) ?
I charge mine 100% every time!
I'm not sure about other countries but here in US, Hyundai has Lifetime Battery Warranty. I called the Hyundai customer service, they told me that the battery warranty is "up to the dealers" to determine if it can be covered under warranty. I called the local dealer, they said it depends on the situation, they need to test the battery to find out.... blah blah blah....
Too many things to think about, so I just made it simple. I charge 100%. so far I have no issues I've had my car for 5 months now. I figured that if the battery fails, i just have the dealer replace it.
I'm not sure about other countries but here in US, Hyundai has Lifetime Battery Warranty. I called the Hyundai customer service, they told me that the battery warranty is "up to the dealers" to determine if it can be covered under warranty. I called the local dealer, they said it depends on the situation, they need to test the battery to find out.... blah blah blah....
Too many things to think about, so I just made it simple. I charge 100%. so far I have no issues I've had my car for 5 months now. I figured that if the battery fails, i just have the dealer replace it.
If you’re happy with that, that’s fine. Although from my readings “lifetime” in USA is not defined, and can be as little as 4 months for some products. But what concerns me is the deterioration, rather than absolute failure, of the battery. I only picked up my Kona MY2020 last week, but have been driving a (Mitsubishi) PHEV for some years & that has made me more cautious with traction batteries.I charge mine 100% every time!
I'm not sure about other countries but here in US, Hyundai has Lifetime Battery Warranty. I called the Hyundai customer service, they told me that the battery warranty is "up to the dealers" to determine if it can be covered under warranty. I called the local dealer, they said it depends on the situation, they need to test the battery to find out.... blah blah blah....
Too many things to think about, so I just made it simple. I charge 100%. so far I have no issues I've had my car for 5 months now. I figured that if the battery fails, i just have the dealer replace it.
The Hyundai warranty on traction batteries, at least in Aus, is that they will retain 80% charge after 8 years. Mitsubishi has a similar warranty. That sounds about where I was heading with my PHEV that I generally charged to 100% each time. A 100% charge when new gave me about 50km range in summer & 40km in winter. After 5 years this had reduced to (about) 40km in summer & 30km in winter.
There was no sign that the batteries would fail entirely, so there were no grounds for a claim against the 8 year Mitsubishi battery warranty. But the distance I could get on an icy morning was getting to the point that I couldn’t make the 23km round trip to work without using the ICE.
From my research, the remedy for this loss of charge/range in Li batteries is to exercise some care in charging. Doesn’t have to be onerous though. Simply keeping battery charge between 20 & 80% most of the time as suggested here should mean the car will keep its range a lot longer. As the Kona has a big battery this should rarely affect driving.
While we still don’t know the cause of fires in Teslas (& one Kona in Canada) I note that Tesla is reducing max charge in their older models X & S to 80% as a precaution. While that caution may prove unnecessary it gives me another incentive to minimise charging to 100%. Likewise Apple iPhone software (currently in beta for release in next update) will introduce rapid charging to 80%.
Everyone is different in their demands on cars & if you want to charge to 100% every time that’s fine. If you’re only doing short trips there should be no noticeable problems. But I want to do some trips that will challenge the kona’s range over coming years & want to retain the ability to do this.
That's great to know! I charged to 100% a few times and enjoyed the extra range but then I got spooked and set my max charge to 80%... for no reason other than what I have read. I wish I could find some sort of official documentation that supports what @Gasbuggy claims as I've seen a few people say that dashboard 100% is really the battery 80%. If that is true I would love to charge to dashboard 100% everytime - I have yet to see anything official on that claim. Smart if true. I wish Hyundai would give out some more info on this.I charge mine 100% every time!
I'm not sure about other countries but here in US, Hyundai has Lifetime Battery Warranty. I called the Hyundai customer service, they told me that the battery warranty is "up to the dealers" to determine if it can be covered under warranty. I called the local dealer, they said it depends on the situation, they need to test the battery to find out.... blah blah blah....
Too many things to think about, so I just made it simple. I charge 100%. so far I have no issues I've had my car for 5 months now. I figured that if the battery fails, i just have the dealer replace it.
Yeah it’s a pain not having facts about this. Not sure why Hyundai doesn’t publish more information. IP perhaps? I think Tesla started this secret battery business & others have followed suit.
It was interesting that when I picked up my new Kona last week, the salesman set my max charge for both AC & DC to 80% & suggested I only charge tp 100% if going on a longer trip.
I'm still 100% charging after 10,000 miles still gets 307 mile range. I'm keeping a log so i can hope to share it to you guys later someday....
I heard Tesla has some studies showing battery degradation that is around 5% after driving 100K+ miles which is really insignificant in my opinion. Our battery might be on the same level if not better.
One caveat tho is that i NEVER fast charge my car or at least haven't fast charge it yet only charged in level 2 wall charger. maybe that the one that will degrade your battery faster....
Great information! I actually spoke with a top Hyundai sales rep and he "ran it up the chain off command" and that his sources tell him "there is no problem charging your Kona at 100% as there are stringent safeguards built into the EV battery"
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I've never seen any evidence that the Kona's battery is larger than 64.08 kWh. That's what Hyundai says it is, 356V at 180Ah. One site, Norwegian I think, quotes a higher number but when I queried them by email they told me it was only a guess! The only buffer I can see is that the BMS avoids the last 3 to 6% below an actual 100%, that's visible with Torque Pro, as is cell voltage which tells you exactly where you are in the Li-ion charge envelope, if you care to look. I can only assume that this 3-6% is LG Chem's "buffer" to ensure that they, as a parts supplier, can meet and warranty Hyundai's specified life for a "64 kWh battery".
As for charge SoC, I keep my centered around 60%. So, if I need 40% for my range, I would charge to 80% and discharge to 40%, and so on. Most days I use only 10% but that's probably unusual compared to most owners here.
As for charge SoC, I keep my centered around 60%. So, if I need 40% for my range, I would charge to 80% and discharge to 40%, and so on. Most days I use only 10% but that's probably unusual compared to most owners here.
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We just turned 44,000 kms on our 2019. Got it delivered feb 2019.
we drive approx 170 kms round trip to work 5 days a week.
we charge to 100% each day when we come home plug it in.
we have no issues with battery last charge showed 467 kms full charge.
it’s warrantied in Canada for 8 years or 160 kms.
we drive approx 170 kms round trip to work 5 days a week.
we charge to 100% each day when we come home plug it in.
we have no issues with battery last charge showed 467 kms full charge.
it’s warrantied in Canada for 8 years or 160 kms.
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I suspect if anyone does know, they aren't saying. I've had my Kona EV for about six weeks now and have the same issues you do with vague info. What I have found out is that there is apparently a "buffer" built into the battery system. Hyundai claims 64.1 kwh of useable power. Apparently there is a total of 71-odd kwh available in the batteries and users can't access that last 7 kwh. This protects the system from being totally discharged which apparently is not a good thing.
In light of this I've decided to go with 100% charges. My normal recharge routine is to visit a DC Level 3 charger not far from my house. I like that one because -- for now at least -- it offers free charges. (Yeah, I know; that ain't gonna' last...). There I get the usual 80% charge. Then I come home and plug into my own Level 2 charger which takes about 2 hours to top off to an indicated 100%. So even when the car is supposedly fully charged, I should still have about 10% leeway.
Of course no one at Hyundai will endorse this protocol, but they won't say I shouldn't do it, either. It seems reasonable to me, so I'm going to continue with it until someone can give me a good reason to stop...
You may be right but I haven’t seen evidence of a 71 kWh battery, nor that Hyundai have a 10% leeway. And seems impossible to get details, as you have found out. But depends on how much you need - in my case an 80% charge will last me a few days before it gets below 30%. Charging every few days is convenient, so unless I actually need that extra charge (or see actual evidence) I think I’ll keep to an indicated max of 80%.
Last time I saw calculation of the Kona battery capacity a researcher deduced a theoretical max of 67.1 kWh, although Hyundai only claim 64. I had always presumed, as Kiwi notes about warranty above, the difference was allowance for fact that no matter how careful you are in battery construction/installation batteries will rarely (if ever) reach their theoretical capacity due to impurities and damage incurred in manufacture, transportation & installation, etc.
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